Harvard Medical School · Brigham and Women’s Hospital
Comparative biology of aging — and the honesty to say we don’t understand it · Boston
Levels of Longevity Map Vadim explores
Vadim Gladyshev is one of 100+ experts in the Live Beyond Project — a father & son quest for longevity.
Discover Live Beyond →Vadim Gladyshev runs a laboratory at Harvard studying the comparative biology of aging. The work spans model organisms — mostly mice — and the species that break the rules: whales, naked mole rats, bats. It also spans human cohorts, tissues and cells. The comparisons are the point.
One of them is quietly startling. The cells inside your body share a genome and an ancestral cell, yet have wildly different lifespans: some turn over constantly, while neurons and cardiomyocytes are expected to last the whole life. Same instructions, same organism, radically different longevity. Whatever explains that is likely to explain a great deal else.
His definition of aging is the accumulation of the negative changes that come from being alive — molecular damage, mutations, byproducts of metabolism, other forms of disorganisation. But he refuses to be glib about what follows from it. What is the enemy? What should an intervention target? Damage? A programme? Function? He points out that function is treacherous as a measure: cognitive performance swings across a single day by something like a decade’s worth, and you can train muscle and cognition upward. Does that mean you became younger? He does not think the question has been answered.
Then there is the comparison that should unsettle the whole field. Nature has changed mammalian lifespan enormously — from an ancestral animal of roughly twelve years, some species went down, others went far up — and it did so apparently easily. In the laboratory we fail. Caloric restriction, rapamycin, lifestyle: ten, twenty, occasionally forty percent in mice, and in humans perhaps two or three. Whatever nature is doing, he concludes, is not what we are doing.
And so the sentence that gives this page its title. He says it without drama, as a working scientist stating the state of the evidence: we do not currently understand aging — and anyone telling you otherwise, or claiming to know how to target it, is wrong.
We filmed with Vadim in his lab in Boston, and again at the Biomarkers of Aging conference at Harvard, which he helps organise. Marek deliberately left the long-lived animals alone — the whales and the naked mole rats — because Aleksander wanted to ask about those himself. What we got instead was something rarer than a set of findings: a very senior scientist carefully explaining the size of what is still unknown.
“My main goal is to understand aging. It’s impossible to target without understanding — and currently there is no understanding of aging.”
— Vadim Gladyshev, Boston“Whoever tells you that they understand aging, or that they know how to target it — it’s wrong. We don’t know.”
Vadim Gladyshev · Harvard, BostonThe cells of the same organism have the same genome and completely different lifespans. What makes some live longer and some shorter?
Vadim GladyshevAging is the accumulation of the negative changes of life — molecular damage, but not only.
Vadim GladyshevFunction is very modifiable. Cognitive function changes across a day by about ten years’ worth. Does that mean you got younger?
Vadim GladyshevNature can change lifespan radically, apparently easily. When we try in the lab, we fail no matter what we do.
Vadim GladyshevFrom our conversation in Boston — what he actually wants to know, why he distrusts the obvious measures, and the gap between evolution and the laboratory.
Neurons and heart muscle cells are expected to last a lifetime. Others are replaced constantly. Same genome, same organism, same ancestral cell — and lifespans that differ by orders of magnitude. He treats that as one of the most informative unexplained facts in biology.
“They have the same genome, and wildly different lifespans. How come?”
Boston · from the interviewDamage, a developmental programme, mortality, or function? He argues the field has not settled this, and that function in particular is a trap — it improves with training and swings within a single day, without anyone becoming biologically younger.
“We need to understand what is our enemy — what should we target?”
Boston · from the interviewEvolution moved mammalian lifespan from around twelve years to both extremes, seemingly without difficulty. Caloric restriction and rapamycin give ten to forty percent in mice, and two or three in humans. The mismatch tells him our mechanisms are not nature’s.
“Whatever we do in the lab is not the same as how nature changes lifespan.”
Boston · from the interviewNo Wikipedia article found for Vadim.
The video interview is coming. Recorded interviews go live after the launch of the film & series Live Beyond.
Selected passages from our conversation with Vadim Gladyshev — Boston, November 2024. Lightly edited for readability.
Vadim Gladyshev“Both animals and humans. We have model organisms in the lab, primarily mice, but we also work across species — whales, naked mole rats, bats. And we work with humans, human cohorts, but also at the cellular and tissue level. All kinds of different systems.”
Vadim Gladyshev“Some cells in our bodies live the whole life, like neurons or cardiomyocytes. They are cells of the same organism, from the same ancestral cell, with the same genome — and completely different lifespans. How come they have such different lifespans? What makes some live longer and others shorter? Is it controlled the same way across species?”
Marek Piotrowski“What excites you most? Is there a specific goal that is your main mission?”
Vadim Gladyshev“My main goal is to understand aging. That’s really the main goal — because if we want to target it, we need to understand it. It’s impossible to target without understanding. And currently there is no understanding of aging. So whoever tells you that they understand it, or that they know how to target it — it’s wrong. We don’t know.”
Vadim Gladyshev“My thinking about aging is the accumulation of negative changes of life — molecular damage, but not only. We need to understand what is our enemy. What should we target? Should we target damage, or a programme, or function? To me, what is upstream is the negative consequence of being alive that produces damage: mutations, byproducts of metabolism, other forms of disorganisation. This system of negative changes. It’s very difficult to describe. It’s very difficult to target.”
Vadim Gladyshev“Think about function — function is very modifiable. If you look at changes in cognitive function during the day, it shifts by about ten years’ worth from morning to evening. You can train to improve cognitive function. You can train to improve muscle function. Does that mean you get younger, or not?”
Vadim Gladyshev“Sometimes we work very hard and we’re very tired, and we feel really older. And then we sleep, or we go on vacation, or we just rest — and we feel rejuvenated. How can we target that system, so that it would change the biological age?”
Vadim Gladyshev“There was maybe an ancestral mammal of about twelve years. During evolution some species decreased lifespan, like mice and rats, and some increased, like whales and humans. Nature can apparently do it easily, changing something in the genes and other processes to achieve radical changes in lifespan. And when we try to do it in the lab, we fail, no matter what we do — caloric restriction, rapamycin, lifestyle changes. In mice, ten percent, twenty, maybe sometimes forty. In humans it’s even less, two or three. This means that whatever we do in the lab is not the same as how nature changes lifespan.”
Marek Piotrowski“What would you wish us, me and my son, for the rest of our quest?”
Vadim Gladyshev“I wish you would make a good documentary. I know it’s very hard — I’ve had many interviews before, and each time somebody making a documentary comes to me and says they will make a great one. Stylistically it’s all the same: people travel, they meet all kinds of people, they do interviews. It’s very difficult to make a documentary in the aging space. I just hope that you can do it. I don’t know how — who you meet, or how you deliver the message. But please do it.”
More passages from the full interview will be published here.
Vadim works across Biohacking Upgrades and Longevity Basics — the measurement and the mechanisms, and the everyday recovery we still can’t explain.
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